welfare

blindbatblindbat Regular
edited November 2011 in Life
lets talk about welfare . good , bad? are u on it? what would you change about it ? get rid of it completely? ... ?

i think we should drug test people that want welfare. shit my hard earned money shouldn't be wasted on some assholes drug fixes . yeah it could be expensive to drug test people , so we should tell them at any moment we can drug test you and if you fail it, no more free monies for you nigger!

Comments

  • SlartibartfastSlartibartfast Global Moderator -__-
    edited November 2011
    welfare is necessary. We don't want people starving to death. We need to assist people with children. We need to help people get back on their feet. The best way to get people off welfare and into jobs is to assist them with living costs until the do. They can then focus on finding work that is sustainable.

    Welfare should be handed out only if their is evidence that the recipient is looking for a job. This means interviews and he must show he is serious. He must not reject a job offer unless there is a serious plausible reason.

    We should also help people who have work but have trouble getting ends to meet. This can take the form of foodstamps.


    frankly we spend more money on worse things.
  • blindbatblindbat Regular
    edited November 2011
    yeah it sucks from what i read they wont give it out if you have a job one that pays shit i mean the minimum , think they should still give it out even though you have a job and still dont make ends meet.
  • DaktologistDaktologist Global Moderator
    edited November 2011
    Most niggers here in NZ get pregnant in their teens and then spend their lives on welfare. It's niggers in particular that do this. IMO they should be forcing abortions on these waste of space cunts that don't want to contribute to society. That and have a time limit on the unemployment benefit.

    I personally believe it should be done away with or at least minimised.
  • jehsiboijehsiboi Kanga Rump Ranga
    edited November 2011
    Most niggers here in NZ get pregnant in their teens and then spend their lives on welfare. It's niggers in particular that do this. IMO they should be forcing abortions on these waste of space cunts that don't want to contribute to society. That and have a time limit on the unemployment benefit.

    I personally believe it should be done away with or at least minimised.

    Yeah aus has the baby bonus and you get more money with each kid .. So you have fat lazy white trash bitches who haven't worked a day in their life raking in $1500 a fortnight getting rent assistance help with school fees help with food and shit who just keep breeding like a dog on heat ... The blacks here get ridiculous amounts of money here no matter how many children they have so it doesn't really matter ... But it has its flaws but can you imagine if it wasn't in place the kind of slums we would have it would be like living in a 3rd world country ... I see welfare as a way to keep the losers and failures of this country on just on par with everyone else kinda like a handicap of the game of life ... It's such a small amount of money per fortnight for regular dole blusters that it's not much of a problem and (most) people will take a job if they can get one
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    Welfare should be workfare. Those who are getting assistance from the public fund should be required to do public works such as picking up litter in parks, fixing roads, cutting grass on public property, or any other non safety service related tasks that cities, states, and provinces normally must pay to have performed out of the same tax base that pays for welfare. They should be required to work a normal 40 hour week just like those who pay taxes to fund their assistance. This would help offset the cost of welfare, keep these people occupied so they had less "leisure" time to seek alleviation from boredom and what not through drug use, and perhaps even motivate them to get a real job that paid real money instead of busting their asses for 40 hours a week just to survive.
  • RemadERemadE Global Moderator
    edited November 2011
    I get help with my Medical costs here in the UK. In short I get my prescriptions free. I do feel guilty, but if I had to pay then it'd be in excess of £60 a month, which is impossible for me as a Student, although my part time job pays, I need to pay rent etc. However I insist on not claiming back any tax as it's my way of reimbursing the System I feel like I'm cheating.

    As for Student help, I have been offered "Disabled Students Allowance" which I only take in the most severe of times. There are days where I can't walk so the Student Finance company will pay me a bit to get a Taxi to a lecture. It's pretty menial when compared to the amount of Dyslexic (which I don't consider a real thing) Students who get free laptops, printers, discounted accommodation and customised/ergonomic furniture to help them out.
    My Mum is pushing for me to get Benefits/Disabled Living Allowance, but I'm too proud to apply. Sure, some money for petrol for the Hospital visits would be nice, plus some extra cash in case i cannot work, however I hate being a sponge to the state. I take as little as I need, although some days I'm so low I just want to end it all because of my conditions. I see people like this, who I just want to shoot as they make people such as myself and others with legitimate disabilities look like lazy good-for-nothings when we do our fair share, and if we can't, then we will endeavour to. The word "benefits" in the UK is interchangable with "lazy".


    This is a perfect example.
  • dr rockerdr rocker Regular
    edited November 2011
    RemadE wrote: »
    I get help with my Medical costs here in the UK. In short I get my prescriptions free. I do feel guilty, but if I had to pay then it'd be in excess of £60 a month, which is impossible for me as a Student, although my part time job pays, I need to pay rent etc. However I insist on not claiming back any tax as it's my way of reimbursing the System I feel like I'm cheating.

    No, it would cost you £104 a year, which is £8.66 a month. Its the price of a packet of cigarettes and a bag of chips, or the price of three or four pints. I am sure you would rather pay £8.66 a month and have the control the meds give you rather than spend it fecklessly and have no drugs.

    TDR's idea of 'workfare' is a good one, however, I do not think it goes far enough. We should bring back something similar to the workhouse. You want to eat, you work. No pay in money, just in food and shelter. Hitler had the right idea getting people to build roads for bowls of soup.

    The sooner we stop paying welfare, the quicker the weak, the sick and the feckless will stop breeding more of their own kind. We are in actual fact paying people to create more of a burden for society to deal with. It is time this stopped.
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    Your ideas are often draconian and reek of adolescence at times dr rocker.
  • dr rockerdr rocker Regular
    edited November 2011
    Your ideas are often draconian and reek of adolescence at times dr rocker.

    If it takes a draconian measure to fix a problem, so be it. With regards to it reeking of adolescence, may red wines have a smell like leather, but contain none.
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    dr rocker wrote: »
    If it takes a draconian measure to fix a problem, so be it. With regards to it reeking of adolescence, may red wines have a smell like leather, but contain none.

    I will remember that if you ever become a problem. But in my book if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then I am having duck for dinner.
  • juggjugg Regular
    edited November 2011
    blindbat wrote: »
    yeah it could be expensive to drug test people , so we should tell them at any moment we can drug test you and if you fail it, no more free monies

    This idea inst bad, but the douche bag who started it is a crook..
    One of the more popular services at Solantic, the urgent care chain co-founded by Florida Gov. Rick Scott, is drug testing, according to Solantic CEO Karen Bowling.
    Given Solantic's role in that marketplace, critics are again asking whether Scott's policy initiatives - this time, requiring drug testing of state employees and welfare recipients - are designed to benefit Scott's bottom line.The Palm Beach Post reported in an exclusive story two weeks ago that while Scott divested his interest in Solantic in January, the controlling shares went to a trust in his wife's name.This raised a groundswell of concern and questions about his health policy initiatives, especially his push to move Medicaid into private HMOs. Solantic does not take Medicaid but does business with private Medicaid HMOs. The questions are growing louder with Scott's executive order on drug testing.
    Solantic charges $35 for drug tests
  • RemadERemadE Global Moderator
    edited November 2011
    dr rocker wrote: »
    No, it would cost you £104 a year, which is £8.66 a month. Its the price of a packet of cigarettes and a bag of chips, or the price of three or four pints. I am sure you would rather pay £8.66 a month and have the control the meds give you rather than spend it fecklessly and have no drugs.

    The costs vary depending on if I have my injections and medical drinks, so it can increase or decrease. I'd love to see you in my shoes for a month or so.

    As for breeding, I don't want kids, so you can spout your pseudo-eugenics off and I'll just keep on with my life. Got another 9 years left until I'm told I'll bite the bullet, pop my clogs or just go wherever life takes me. Now that's motivation for self betterment.
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    Pay no attention to dr rocker RemadE, he is a troll trying to hide in a scholars robes. All he does is come into threads, look for the popular opinion, take a contrary position for the sake of creating an argument, and hope that he "wins" so he can boost his low self esteem IRL. As our community grows in the new mature direction we have set course on more and more members will let him know how transparent he really is and he will go away on his own.

    Now I am not saying he does not have potential to be a part of that growth but he needs to drop his need to "win" arguments over semantics with others and concentrate intellect I know he posses towards useful contributions to discussions. Either that or I have totally misread him and he is just a thick little twit.
  • TurdaluraDooDooTurdaluraDooDoo Semo-Regulars
    edited November 2011
    Welfare is ok for short term when a person hits a streak of bad luck but not as a way of life.
  • jehsiboijehsiboi Kanga Rump Ranga
    edited November 2011
    We have work for the dole which places people in volunteer work and if the don't show up their payments are cut .. It's a good idea cause they are essentially working for no extra and it motivates them to get a paying job
  • scotchscotch Semo-Regulars
    edited November 2011
    People on welfare are usually in a vicious cycle that keeps them there. Simply solve the social problems that lead to a lot of people needing it, and there you go!

    It's a complex solution to a complex problem, but then everything is.
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    scotch wrote: »
    People on welfare are usually in a vicious cycle that keeps them there. Simply solve the social problems that lead to a lot of people needing it, and there you go!

    It's a complex solution to a complex problem, but then everything is.

    The problem is poverty which has existed since the beginning of recorded history. I don't see that ending anytime soon. There were always be those who hunt better than others.
  • edited November 2011
    I dont think Dr rocker is being incredibly unreasonable.

    We are consuming the earths resources at an unsustainable rate. We are diverting income and resources from the most productive parts to the least productive - offering a false signal for reproduction.

    Ever seen the movie Idiocracy?
    When theres this many people on earth life gets cheap and the misery that is born of poverty is enough to make anyone ashamed of being human - it is kinder to make sure they do not exist in the first place.

    I dont think you understand that is a real and system resource shortage. It is in part a product of corporations controlling various resources and in a large part governments misallocating the wealth of nations; there will be a time when all these debts will need to be paid and nobody will be able to afford to do it.

    The ponzi scheme of the welfare state is unsustainable; the socialists/communists/left wingers will argue that capitalism is unsustainable because it focuses on incessant growth - but their solution is no better.

    The strong should naturally dominate the weak, stragglers should be left behind and when the fury of mother nature comes to human settlements once we have severe energy shortages, lack of water, lack of food - she will suffer no fools.
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    If the strong were left to prey on the weak we would still be running about in skins eating nuts and gathering berries. I am not a socialists by any stretch of the imagination. I don't care what you think I understand after reading some of the tripe you post. If you want to know what I understand spend a day with me in TeamSpeak as I am not going to type out all the things you don't know I know or that would be required to help you understand how silly you are with your black and white view of things.
  • jehsiboijehsiboi Kanga Rump Ranga
    edited November 2011
    Welfare should be more about giving people the tools to succeed where their up bringing left them short ... It's not about hitting a rough patch and not being able to get back on the horse ... When people who are rich fail and go bankrupt 9 times outa 10 they will build themselves up again . But for someone who has no real clue how to survive in this world giving them coin without making them work for it is disabling them in the long run ... It's a tough issue and some of my opinions on it directly contradict each other. but im just a blue collar guy and if I broke my legs or even just my hands I would have no way of earning money ... So I'm glad we have welfare because it's a system that I can fall back on if for some reason I can no longer work in my profession. Allowing me to live while learning some other way of earning money ... But it should not be abused and should have tough penalties if it is found out that someone is abusing it .... Cause in the end if you are getting money under the guise that you can't work when you can, that sounds like fraud to me
  • Darth BeaverDarth Beaver Meine Ehre heißt Treue
    edited November 2011
    That is an honest and reasonable point of view jehsiboi.
  • chippychippy <b style="color:pink;">Global Moderator</b>
    edited November 2011
    Yeah it sums up my view too, good post.
  • edited November 2011
    When i say the strong dominate the weak i dont mean explicitly 'BIG MAN HIT LITTLE MAN TAKE FOOD' I mean the better man wins.

    The farmer who diversified his crops so a sudden storm wouldn't leave him starving.
    The fisherman who decided that it was worth giving his fish to another to make a net so he could gather more.
    There was a time when people who were useful to society were the ones in charge of keeping it going.

    If you dont believe the strong should dominate the weak then you should seriously consider being a socialist.

    If you want to subsidise inefficient operations instead of allowing a business to be overtaken by its rivals.
    If you want people who contribute more than their share to give it up to those who cant earn a place in society.
    If the fisherman should just give his fish to everyone and dream about getting the spare time to make a net.
    If the farmer ruins the arable land he should be given more to destroy.

    That's what welfare is.

    There are more people today then the world needs. That is a simple fact. All ecosystems are coming under increasing pressure, monetary systems are close to failure because they've been so distorted by government intervention and we have a whole lot of discourse on human rights but fuck all discussion about human responsibilities.

    You can pull the climate change denier card but you still need to recognise that everyday when you take a shit it flushes into a water supply somewhere. You might do one or two eco friendly things but that doesnt matter. Your lifestyle is toxic to the earth just like mine. Fortunately a healthy environment can absorb and flourish with a certain level of contamination and the world keeps turning.

    But once you get this many people living on earth things start to get bad.

    There's a buffalo farm just outside of Karachi that produces thousands of tonnes of manure everyday that goes straight into the river, right into the ocean. Those phosphate loads FUCK the shit out the marine life and pretty soon you wont be able to do much fishing there at all. You will have a great deal of trouble securing clean water supplies and the clincher is that because the river is poorly managed so they're losing actual landmass at an astonishing rate.

    Maybe if there were less people being born, more intelligent people working as part as a part of society and not as a leech on it we might be able to make some good out of this. We might be able to put a methane digester on site and actually run a power plant off the manure and provide the treated product as fertilizer.

    But we aren't. Because people deny that we have any kind of an impact on the environment like morons.

    Welfare just encourages the idiots to think that everything is ok and theres just a bottomless pit of money to pay for things somewhere.

    I used to go to class and there's these drop kicks sitting there talking about how the government should pay for this and that - nobody has a sense of economic reality and they have no grasp on an honest days work for an honest days pay. Working no other job, contributing nothing to society but their agitations for 'someone else' to take action about various issues.

    Since people just pick random degrees on useless bullshit instead of learning to do something that people need done you end up with a bunch of socialist horse shit like these occupy movements. People angry that their 100k degree in media majoring in gender theory doesnt have much to give to the world.

    The occupy people are at least slightly closer to the point of actually doing something; but they should really be occupying the horse shit universities that arent training people for the economic reality that is out there. That jobs are hard to find. That taxes are high. That regulations WILL stop you from starting your own ventures.

    They want a bailout just like everyone else. Welfare is a bailout.

    Call it tripe but you cannot justify paying donny dickhead or shaniqua shitbitch $$$ a week to keep on having kids.
    But hey i guess the 9th retarded one might end up being Beethoven!

    The middle class is being crushed and the welfare class is growing. Innovation is being crushed by the zombie lawyers and government bureaucracy. Freedom is being eroded from every angle to the point where the USA now has TSA checkpoints on highways.

    But im not against welfare persay. Im against the government being involved.

    I've had friends who failed in business ventures or other troubles who have stayed with me for a month or two to get their shit sorted out and start making money again.
    I've seen churches run soup kitchens for people who really are struggling to eat and offer rehabilitation and job services for people who want to clean up and get out of that.

    The pain and suffering of the poor houses was of the children, and i think that goverment orphanages and child protection places should be getting a whole lot more funding - but i think that once you're out in the world its sink or swim.
  • RemadERemadE Global Moderator
    edited November 2011
    jehsiboy and MOMT pretty much sum up my views. Govt regulation is all well and good, but it's the burearocracy that kills the effectiveness of the welfare system as it allows for so many fraudsters to get through the net, per say. It's even on BBCs Panorama as it's a huge news subject over here.
    Welfare should be there to help those who cant work, be able to survive during the time they are unable to work. It's not designed to buy luxury - just survive and get by.
    Unfortunately with rising food prices, fuel prices (both for vehicles and homes) and other aspects of life becoming more expensive, surviving off benefits, not least here in the UK as I cannot speak for anywhere else, is becoming damn hard. Living on the minimum wage is also a challenge (as you'd expect), and this was a great read regarding the possibility of living on said wage. I found a blog where somebody tried living on benefits for a year and another on the minimum wage, but cannot remember where they were online. Good blogs.
  • blindbatblindbat Regular
    edited November 2011
    i wonder how much people on welfare get? say 1 - 2 k a month? anyone know?
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