Abortion

DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
edited October 2010 in Spurious Generalities
Since this discussion didnt belong in S&A I will continue it here:hai: Anyway what is everyones position on Abortion? I feel it is Murder because God said he knew us in our mothers womb.
I knew you before I formed you in your mother’s womb. Jeremiah 1:5

Life begins at conception and abortion is shouldn't more than baby killing. If a woman doesn't want to be pregnant then she shouldn't have slept around. The way I see it if you dont want the kid then give it up for adoption. Abortion is nothing more than legalized murder.
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Comments

  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    What about rape? When and if the kid finds out, they'll have to live with the pain of knowing they were the product of an evil act.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Mayberry wrote: »
    What about rape? When and if the kid finds out, they'll have to live with the pain of knowing they were the product of an evil act.

    If she's raped it still doesn't give her the right to murder the kid who had no part in the act. It's still a life even if it was the product of rape.
  • Gary OakGary Oak Regular
    edited October 2010
    Me likes.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Gary Oak wrote: »
    Me likes.

    You like what?
  • Gary OakGary Oak Regular
    edited October 2010
    teh abortinz
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    spazz wrote: »
    sanchezzzzzzzz,

    what if i murder you. is that morally wrong? or does it just piss you off?

    Murdering me would be morally wrong. Plus I wouldn't let myself get murdered.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    What's morally wrong is having a child when you're nowhere near ready for it. You'll be throwing your own life away and the child's life. That kid is going to grow up in a poor environment (unless you just so happen to be from a wealthy family) and let's face it, most kids that grow up in poverty do not turn out too well. Every single person on this planet makes a mistake, and getting pregnant is damn well categorized as a mistake in certain situations. We have abortion so that we can fix that mistake, just like we have white-out. It isn't a fucking person until it is pushed out and introduced to the world, in my opinion. Until then it is a DEVELOPING person. Why not correct what you've wronged, learn from it, fucking try again when you and your partner is ready, and introduce a kid into the world the proper way.

    Fuck your religious bullshit. If god knew what was right, he would have aborted us.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    You still haven't answered why Murder is ok when giving it up for adoption works just as well. I agree sometimes people fuck up. If thats the case fucking deal with it and give the kid away don't murder a baby because you were a slut you know. You can say fuck your religious bullshit all you want but I dont see the words of my Lord and Saviour as bullshit. Do you really believe what you say? "oops I fucked now I'll kill a baby? Do you really think a man like Dr. George Tiller was doing the right thing?
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    You still haven't answered why Murder is ok when giving it up for adoption works just as well. I agree sometimes people fuck up. If thats the case fucking deal with it and give the kid away don't murder a baby because you were a slut you know. You can say fuck your religious bullshit all you want but I dont see the words of my Lord and Saviour as bullshit. Do you really believe what you say? "oops I fucked now I'll kill a baby? Do you really think a man like Dr. George Tiller was doing the right thing?

    I argued adoption in the other thread. Yes, adoption is definitely an option, but it sure as fuck isn't guaranteed that the kid will have it any better than if he were dead. Not every orphan get's adopted into a loving family with the promise of a better life.

    And maybe some people feel more comfortable knowing 100% that they don't have a kid somewhere out in the world that could either be starving, on the streets, being abused or getting raped, or could have had that slim chance of coming into a good life with a loving family.
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    If she's raped it still doesn't give her the right to murder the kid who had no part in the act. It's still a life even if it was the product of rape.

    A vegetable is life but we eat them. Until the bundle of cells in the woman develops a nervous system, it is not sentient and cannot feel. Better off giving a sort of 'mercy killing' than to have a kid grow up knowing only neglect and suffering.

    Also, I like your Bible quote. Isn't it nice to take things out of context? God was speaking to Jeremiah and how he had planned for Jeremiah to be a prophet even before birth:
    "Then the word of the Lord came unto me, saying, Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. Then said I, Ah, Lord GOD! behold, I cannot speak: for I am a child. But the Lord said unto me, Say not, I am a child: for thou shalt go to all that I shall send thee, and whatsoever I command thee thou shalt speak. Be not afraid of their faces: for I am with thee to deliver thee, saith the Lord. Then the Lord put forth his hand, and touched my mouth. And the Lord said unto me, Behold, I have put my words in thy mouth. See, I have this day set thee over the nations and over the kingdoms, to root out, and to pull down, and to destroy, and to throw down, to build, and to plant." Jeremiah 1:4-10
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    I argued adoption in the other thread. Yes, adoption is definitely an option, but it sure as fuck isn't guaranteed that the kid will have it any better than if he were dead. Not every orphan get's adopted into a loving family with the promise of a better life.

    Theres no garuntees in life but an adopted kid sure as fuck has a better chance than a kid who gets MURDERED by an abortion doctor. It's a fucked up world when murder is the solution to lifes mistakes.
  • thewandererthewanderer Regular
    edited October 2010
    Why should someone have to go through all the bullshit involved in having a kid if they dont want one to begin with? An abortion is a responsible choice in many cases. Besides, the world is over populated enough as is.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Why should someone have to go through all the bullshit involved in having a kid if they dont want one to begin with? An abortion is a responsible choice in many cases. Besides, the world is over populated enough as is.

    They shouldn't so they shouldn't be sluts. Why is the concept of not fucking if you dont want a kid so hard to understand?
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Theres no garuntees in life but an adopted kid sure as fuck has a better chance than a kid who gets MURDERED by an abortion doctor. It's a fucked up world when murder is the solution to lifes mistakes.

    Murder is taking someones LIFE. A fetus does not have a life. A fetus is PRE-life, meaning BEFORE if you're too uneducated to grasp that concept. It's kind of like the egg of a chicken, you know, how you cook it up in a frying pan for breakfast? Well you're cooking what COULD have been another chicken. Is that murder?

    Maybe, just fucking maybe the people who conceived the child weren't being selfish, and they knew that they fucked up and knew that if they were to keep it, that the kid would ultimately have a shitty life, so they aborted it, which fucking mind you wouldn't just be some "tra-la-la-la-la let's get this kid aborted!!!" it would be a devastating and difficult decision for a couple to make, but an intelligent one where it's needed.

    There's this one asshole that has been standing on the side of the road since my fucking dad was a kid, with a baby doll strapped to his chest holding a sign in protest against abortion, because your God says that it's wrong. This guy makes me fucking sick, because you people seem to think that it's a selfish and light decision.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    It is a selfish fucking decision. Like I said earlier God who is YOUR creator and father whether you like it or not says that life begins in the womb. It is murder. An abortion doctor will face the same punishment as an unrepentant murderer when he dies. How is it not selfish to say "I dont want this kid so I'll just murder it". People that advocate abortion advocate child murder. Especially with all the forms of birth control today available its even more evil.
  • thewandererthewanderer Regular
    edited October 2010
    People that dont pay attention to religion shouldn't be governed by it.
  • AlbinoEthiopianAlbinoEthiopian Regular
    edited October 2010
    Dirty, so you like rape, but you are against abortion? So if you rape a girl and you pregnant her unwillingly she should have to keep your kid? Shouldn't she have the option to have an abortion because she never did want to have a kid?

    Just some thoughts.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    It is a selfish fucking decision. Like I said earlier God who is YOUR creator and father whether you like it or not says that life begins in the womb. It is murder. An abortion doctor will face the same punishment as an unrepentant murderer when he dies. How is it not selfish to say "I dont want this kid so I'll just murder it". People that advocate abortion advocate child murder. Especially with all the forms of birth control today available its even more evil.
    You sure do back up the word of God a lot for a person that has a swastika in their avatar.

    Is attempted genocide the will of God or did I miss something?
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    Here's another bible quote for you:
    "If a man fathers a hundred children and lives many years, however many they be, but his soul is not satisfied with good things, and he does not even have a proper burial, then I say, `Better the miscarriage than he, for it comes in futility and goes into obscurity; and its name is covered in obscurity. It never sees the sun and it never knows anything; it is better off than he.'" Ecclesiastes 6:3-5

    Better off not being born than to live a sub-par life.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    You sure do back up the word of God a lot for a person that has a swastika in their avatar.

    What does the swastika have to do with my faith? If your gonna say Jesus was a jew than go look at my threads in the religion section on here. I follow Christian Identity which states Jesus was Aryan so dont try playing that card. And to Mayberry I believe that quote is sort of like when Jesus said it would have been better for Judas if he wasn't born. It's saying not being born is better than Gods judgment of a sinner.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    What does the swastika have to do with my faith? If your gonna say Jesus was a jew than go look at my threads in the religion section on here. I follow Christian Identity which states Jesus was Aryan so dont try playing that card.

    So...let me just get this straight here...the murder and torture of thousands upon thousands of people...is okay in Gods eyes? Racism is cool with God? Damn...I sure as fuck don't want to follow that evil prick.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    So...let me just get this straight here...the murder and torture of thousands upon thousands of people...is okay in Gods eyes? Racism is cool with God? Damn...I sure as fuck don't want to follow that evil prick.

    Ok so were playing this card. Read this site http://www.ihr.org/ The holocaust was largely a myth. He tried to stop communism. At most 300000 died and that was more due to disease and war than mass murder. Also you'll see the bible states that the Jews of today are the product of when Eve and satan had sex. Therefore when you fight the jew you fight satan. In revelation Jesus speaks of the "false jews" and the "synagogues of Satan".
    I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars--I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.
    Revelation 3:9
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Ok so were playing this card. Read this site http://www.ihr.org/ The holocaust was largely a myth. He tried to stop communism. At most 300000 died and that was more due to disease and war than mass murder. Also you'll see the bible states that the Jews of today are the product of when Eve and satan had sex. Therefore when you fight the jew you fight satan. In revelation Jesus speaks of the "false jews" and the "synagogues of Satan".

    Revelation 3:9
    Jews are Satan now? God damn. You Christians are funny people.
  • thewandererthewanderer Regular
    edited October 2010
    So...let me just get this straight here...the murder and torture of thousands upon thousands of people...is okay in Gods eyes? Racism is cool with God? Damn...I sure as fuck don't want to follow that evil prick.

    I think god is a pretty cool guy. eh supports destruction and doesnt afraid of anything. :cool::cool:
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Jews are Satan now? God damn. You Christians are funny people.

    Yes when eve ate the apple that was symbolic. In reality she fornicated with the serpent which in Genesis God said "And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life" This was in Genesis 3:14. Notice how God also in Genesis says that he made Child birth painful. See he punished her womb instead of her mouth which shows that her and Satan had sex which is where jews originate from. Here is a link which has more info on Christian Identity. http://www.kingidentity.com/
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Yes when eve ate the apple that was symbolic. In reality she fornicated with the serpent which in Genesis God said "And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life" This was in Genesis 3:14. Notice how God also in Genesis says that he made Child birth painful. See he punished her womb instead of her mouth which shows that her and Satan had sex which is where jews originate from. Here is a link which has more info on Christian Identity. http://www.kingidentity.com/

    So you guys fuck snakes also? When does the Christian madness end?!
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    So you guys fuck snakes also? When does the Christian madness end?!

    :facepalm: No Eve fucked the Serpent. That was the sin in the garden of Eden. The serpent was more like man but was cursed and became a snake as we know them today.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    :facepalm: No Eve fucked the Serpent. That was the sin in the garden of Eden. The serpent was more like man but was cursed and became a snake as we know them today.

    Now you fucking people are magicians that can turn other people into snakes!?!?!?!


    Please, oh please, mighty Christian overlord, don't turn me into a snake!
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Now you fucking people are magicians that can turn other people into snakes!?!?!?!


    Please, oh please, mighty Christian overlord, don't turn me into a snake!

    I cant do it fucktard. God did it. He created us why don't you think he can do as he pleases? God can do anything from natural disasters to raising the dead.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    I cant do it fucktard. God did it. He created us why don't you think he can do as he pleases? God can do anything from natural disasters to raising the dead.

    Fucking shit now he's a necromancer AND a geomancer?!?! We're all fucked, apparently.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Fucking shit now he's a necromancer AND a geomancer?!?! We're all fucked, apparently.

    Haha your a funny guy:rolleyes: Now if your done mocking my religion lets get back to the abortion subject shall we?
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    Haha your a funny guy:rolleyes: Now if your done mocking my religion lets get back to the abortion subject shall we?

    It's never gone off track. Mockery of your religion is mockery of your arguments against abortion. Speaking of which, you seem to have ignored the biblical quotes I posted which come from the same bible that you base your beliefs and arguments on.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Haha your a funny guy:rolleyes: Now if your done mocking my religion lets get back to the abortion subject shall we?

    Please go back to elementary school and learn the difference between your and you're, first.
  • SlartibartfastSlartibartfast Global Moderator -__-
    edited October 2010
    If you're going to use the bible as a reason to do something, why not ban extramarital sex and stone Adulterer's? Why are you selectively following the Bible? Why not do everything it says?
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    If you're going to use the bible as a reason to do something, why not ban extramarital sex and stone Adulterer's? Why are you selectively following the Bible? Why not do everything it says?

    Christians tend to use the Bible to back up their arguments only when it's convenient to their favor, if you haven't noticed.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Mayberry wrote: »
    It's never gone off track. Mockery of your religion is mockery of your arguments against abortion. Speaking of which, you seem to have ignored the biblical quotes I posted which come from the same bible that you base your beliefs and arguments on.

    No I actually pondered that quote. Great argument by the way but in the end you'll see that what God is basically saying is death is a better fate then not serving him. You see in the old testament before Christ there were so many rules of God to follow and there was no forgiveness like there is now that Christ died for our sins. So you'll see it's all in context and isn't saying abortion is ok or life doesn't begin at birth.
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    Christians tend to use the Bible to back up their arguments only when it's convenient to their favor, if you haven't noticed.

    Exactly, when I post quotes that undermine him, he just ignores them.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    No I actually pondered that quote. Great argument by the way but in the end you'll see that what God is basically saying is death is a better fate then not serving him. You see in the old testament before Christ there were so many rules of God to follow and there was no forgiveness like there is now that Christ died for our sins. So you'll see it's all in context and isn't saying abortion is ok or life doesn't begin at birth.

    We should be dead rather than serve God all of our life then, eh? That's pretty egotistical of that guy, in my opinion. "Hey you kids!!! Fucking tell me I'm the shit everyday for the rest of your life or die!!!!!"
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Mayberry wrote: »
    Exactly, when I post quotes that undermine him, he just ignores them.

    I didnt ignore it. Youll see a few posts up I answered it at the end as well as the post right above this one.
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    No I actually pondered that quote. Great argument by the way but in the end you'll see that what God is basically saying is death is a better fate then not serving him. You see in the old testament before Christ there were so many rules of God to follow and there was no forgiveness like there is now that Christ died for our sins. So you'll see it's all in context and isn't saying abortion is ok or life doesn't begin at birth.

    You are speaking of the context of my quote, but what of yours? The quote you first posted was heavily taken out of context which I fixed a few posts down. The bible takes no stance on abortion or the beginning of a life. Don't tell me I make the mistake of taking something out of context when you do so such blatantly yourself.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Mayberry wrote: »
    You are speaking of the context of my quote, but what of yours? The quote you first posted was heavily taken out of context which I fixed a few posts down. The bible takes no stance on abortion or the beginning of a life. Don't tell me I make the mistake of taking something out of context when you do so such blatantly yourself.

    Ok fair enough. Here are some more quotes that may change your mind on whether the bible has a stance on abortion.
    Exodus 21 22-23"And if men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him; and he shall pay as the judges decide. But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life."
    And now says the LORD, who formed Me from the womb to be His Servant, To bring Jacob back to Him, in order that Israel might be gathered to Him For I am honored in the sight of the LORD, And My God is My strength (Isaiah 49:5)
    "For he will be great in the sight of the Lord, and he will drink no wine or liquor; and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit, while yet in his mother's womb." (Luke 1:15)
    Yet Thou art He who didst bring me forth from the womb; Thou didst make me trust when upon my mother's breasts. Upon Thee I was cast from birth; Thou hast been my God from my mother's womb. (Psalm 22:9-10)
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Ok fair enough. Here are some more quotes that may change your mind on whether the bible has a stance on abortion.

    Abortion is wrong because God says so guize. That book that was written by man IS THE LAW.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    Abortion is wrong because God says so guize. That book that was written by man IS THE LAW.

    It was written by Men who were inspired by God and who God spoke directly too. So yes it is the law. Maybe it isn't the law of modern man but it is the eternal law that we all must answer too on the day of which there is no more doubt.
  • stresstres Regular
    edited October 2010
    You still haven't answered why Murder is ok

    wait wut? :facepalm:
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    stres wrote: »
    wait wut? :facepalm:

    Thou shalt not kill. Murder IS wrong unless you have a good reason for it such as self defense or war. There are times when it's ok and necessary but murdering a helpless child is fucked up.
  • MasturbatronMasturbatron Regular
    edited October 2010
    Thou shalt not kill. Murder IS wrong unless you have a good reason for it such as self defense or war. There are times when it's ok and necessary but murdering a helpless child is fucked up.

    "Thou shalt not kill." Not "Thou shalt not kill, unless of course it's self defense or you're at war, then it's all cool by me."
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    Exodus 21 22-23"And if men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him; and he shall pay as the judges decide. But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life."

    Great, abortion is less of a crime than murder.
    And now says the LORD, who formed Me from the womb to be His Servant, To bring Jacob back to Him, in order that Israel might be gathered to Him For I am honored in the sight of the LORD, And My God is My strength (Isaiah 49:5)
    "For he will be great in the sight of the Lord, and he will drink no wine or liquor; and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit, while yet in his mother's womb." (Luke 1:15)
    Yet Thou art He who didst bring me forth from the womb; Thou didst make me trust when upon my mother's breasts. Upon Thee I was cast from birth; Thou hast been my God from my mother's womb. (Psalm 22:9-10)

    There is no doubt that at a certain point, there is life in the womb. This has been confirmed by science. However, before that point, all that is in the womb is a bundle of non-sentient cells. They can neither feel nor think, just like a vegetable. This is abortion. Removing a mass of cells like picking a vegetable from a garden.
  • DirtySanchezDirtySanchez Regular
    edited October 2010
    "Thou shalt not kill." Not "Thou shalt not kill, unless of course it's self defense or you're at war, then it's all cool by me."

    Dont be retarded. Yes murder is fine if it's in defense of God Country Race or Family. And to Mayberry I will agree with abortion in extreme cases if it's only a few weeks old but you have to agree all this late term abortion stuff is evil. Also who are we to decide when the childs life begins?
  • MayberryMayberry Regular
    edited October 2010
    And to Mayberry I will agree with abortion in extreme cases if it's only a few weeks old but you have to agree all this late term abortion stuff is evil. Also who are we to decide when the childs life begins?

    My work here is done mayberrysmilie.gif

    I'm not going to say what's evil and what's not, but I can say that there's ample time for people to make up their mind for an abortion before the embryo becomes sentient. It's hard to say when life begins, but for current measures, the ability to think, to feel, and to experience that comes with the development of a nervous system will have to do until more is known.
  • stresstres Regular
    edited October 2010
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